Public Meeting

 

Dallas, Texas

 

February ????

 

 

How Does Tithing and Seed Money Work?

 

QUESTION:      I have a question about tithing. Does it diminish the effect of tithing if you, say, put ten percent in two or more places, or should it go ten percent in one fund or one direction? What I was thinking about is the Philadelphia Fund and Adelphi.

 

RICHARD KIENINGER:      The way that works is if you always give to one place, then it has the effect of seed money, and seed money works this way: If you are tithing to an organization which is really doing something which is uplifting mankind, then we call that doing Godís work. There isnít anything we can do for God, but as I understand it, Creation was developed for sentient beings to elevate themselves to the point of being Angels and Archangels and then in the Celestial Host. So anything which benefits that kind of growth of mankind is doing Godís work. If you are giving to such an organization and you always give right to the penny ten percent, then those Higher Beings who want to see that particular activity benefit more and more will then find ways of leading you or leading the world to some kind of a situation which will improve your income, because they know that every time your income improves, that much more is going to go to their project. So you get that kind of assistance if you do it to the penny. The reason why thatís important is if you are just scattering it around to wherever you think something is good, it may still all be for Godís work essentially, but they canít depend on the project that theyíre working on getting any benefit by increasing your income. So thatís where the seed money effect comes in. However you want to divide it up, as long as itís ten percent, it works okay. But one of the nice things about the seed money effect is that if they increase your salary by $100óI donít say that theyíre giving you more or somehow theyíre influencing your bossóbut they find opportunities or lead you and the opportunities together so that you can take advantage of those opportunities to increase the return on your efforts. If you get an extra $100/week, thatís $10 more that they know is going to go to their project. You get to keep the other $90. Thatís yours. So the seed money idea is very beneficial to most people, so therefore, people who become very wealthy somehow or other seem to get the information from somewhere that when they are doing the things that are of benefit to mankind, they get more and more money all the time so they can do more for mankind, But they get richer in the process. I hope that answers your question.

 

Is Tithing Based on a Personís Net or Gross Income?

 

Q:      Just a follow-up. Should the ten percent be based on your gross?

 

RK:      On your net. Because you have no control over what the Government takes out of yourówhatever goes for withholding taxes and for Social Security, you donít have any discretion over that; they just take it out and thatís it. So thatís not your real income. Youíre just using your employer as a means of collecting money for Social Security.

 

How Are Health Benefits Figured Into the Tithe?

 

Q:      But you should include health benefits or other things that they take out of your check?

 

RK:      If you donít want them and you never get them, the time to start including health benefits is when you start getting money for youróif you have some illness or something that requires that thereís a payout of some kind for that kind of insurance, well, thatís a benefit that youíre receiving and thatís what you tithe on, is the actual benefit that you get, not how much they take out at the time. So in other words, whatever is deducted from your paycheck in the way of insurance, thatís money thatís gone, so thatís not discretionary so far as youíre concerned either. Itís when you get a benefit from it, then you tithe on that. Hopefully, youíll never collect on it.

 

Who Were the People That Built the Great Pyramid at Gizeh?

 

Q:      I understand that around 4,000 B.C. a group of people in Egypt who were affiliated with the Brotherhoods built the Great Pyramid.

 

RK:      Most of them didnít know they were affiliated with the Brotherhoods; the leaders knew.

 

Q:      The people didnít know? I was wondering how big of a group engineered that and how man worked on it. Do you have any information on that?

 

RK:      Little smatterings of information from my teachers. There were about 100,000 persons per year worked on building the Great Pyramid.

 

How Was the Pyramid Built?

 

Q:      Each year 100,000 different ones?

 

RK:      No, not necessarily, but thatís about how many were required. It took about one-hundred years to build it. And the method by which it was built is really very unusual. But they didnít work full time on it. All the people who worked on the projectóand the people who were nominally in charge of itówere called the Hyksos. Well, the Hyksos were able to give enough information to the general populace to get them enthused about building the Pyramid. As I said, there was never going to be a Pharaoh put in it and thereís no evidence that there ever was anybody buried in it. It doesnít bear anybodyís name. Usually, on the inside they splash pictures and cartouches and what-have-you over every square inch of the place thatís going to be the burial place of the Pharaoh. And the Great Pyramid is the only one that isnít that way. So I think they pretty much convinced people that this was going to be a major marker of something of import for mankind. It was a big job just leveling the plain. Youíve been there; you know what itís like. There are high chalk cliffs nearbyóchalk meaning calcium carbonate or limestoneóand they had to cut that area more or less flat. Actually, that is a spherical section and it was calculated that when the last stone went on the top of the pyramid, the pressure from the weight of the pyramid would finally bring the whole structure so that it was flat. Itís not much of a spherical section, but it was not cut as a perfectly level plane before they started building. Then they dug chambers into the living rock where nothing was built around it. If you take the descending passage to the place where the ground was level, the passageway continues without any stone left around because itís actually cut right into the limestone, It was quite a project just to get started.

 

Q:      How did they cut the stone?

 

RK:      The hard way. But limestone is pretty easy to work with. Actually, limestone is so soft in working it that they did not build the Pyramid out of limestone itself. They made a cementacious material by grinding up the materials that they removed in leveling the area, and they also took some from nearby areas. Still today, if you get down underneath the sand, you find just incredible numbers of chips of limestone, and that stuff was ground down into a dust, perhaps heated in some way, and then mixed so that it would form a rock in place. Then they had to bring incredibly huge pieces of granite from hundreds of miles upriver and they actually floated those into place. They created a canal around the edge of the Pyramid to float these things right up to the place where they were going to be installed, So it didnít require any lifting. They stayed on the boats that they built especially for those huge blocks of granite and they were brought up through a system of locks and the only thing that was required is that cattle keep turning a turnstile to keep pumping water up to the top of the rock and all of that stuff was removed. Then they put Tura limestone on the outside, which is an exceptionally hard limestone, and it was able to be polished to a high degree.

 

Q:      It glistened like a jewel, didnít it?

 

RK:      Right.

 

Q:      At certain times of the day the light would strike it and project rays in the air and things like that.

 

RK:      Right. Over long distances, too. The word for the lighthouse and the word for ruler was essentially the same; itís pharaoh.

 

Q:      Was the outside edge cut on the slope or the last rock as they come to the outside?

 

RK:      Well, they were stepped in so they were resting vertically. The load was on the vertical.

 

Q:      But they didnít cut the outside at the angle of the Pyramid? A Oh, yeah. It was perfectly smooth. There was no way you could climb it.

 

Q:      Was it 90% or was it like this?

 

RK:      51%, I think.

 

Q:      Iíve never seen it close up to see whether itís actually stepped so thereís a ledge at each course.

 

Q:      Each course has a ledge and each course is a different height. No two courses are the same height. And thereís mathematical reasons for that which have a mystical meaning which they created a mystical meaning for.

 

Q:      Arenít the stones that the ruler removed, werenít they made in reverse so that it was straight up and down on the limestone?

 

RK:      Not vertical, It was at the 51% ó

 

Q:      But I mean it wasnít stepped then.

 

RK:      No.

 

Q:      It was stepped on the granite, but not on the limestone?

 

RK:      But each block of Tura limestone, its load was compressing what was below it. They werenít all stacked up on the slide where they could slide off or anything like that.

 

Q:      They were stepped on the inside.

 

RK:      Right, from the inside and smooth on the outside at that angle. Some of those blocks, as we saw, were still in there. Itís about 50 stories high.

 

Q:      Are we ever going to know how and why?

 

RK:      If you live long enough.

 

Q:      In my lifetime? Iím not going to give you any guarantees.

 

What is the Symbolism of the Great Pyramid?

 

 RK:      The reason why it was built in the first place, itís a monument to manís knowledge of the world at that particular time. It face almost preciselyó itís within just a couple of seconds of facing due east north and southóand west, also. But the knowledge that they had of mathematics and of the dimensions of the world are all incorporated in that particular structure. But then on the inside, there was a place whereóI donít know that itís necessarily of the Brotherhoods, but people who have Brotherhood informationóuse that as a place of initiation, and thereís a direct tie-in with all of the dimensions that have been discovered in the Great Pyramid and what is know as the Book of the Dead. And the Book of the Dead really has nothing to do with funerary types of things; it has to do primarily with how many can elevate himself from being just kind of like an animal to being kind of like an Angel, and all the steps that are involved, They have all kinds of symbolic steps that a person went through which was conducted in these various chambers, and thatís the reason why there are chambers in there. The person actually climbed from chaos to the Kingís Chamber in a symbolic way, and as I said, thatís where initiation took place. The Book of the Dead explains it pretty carefully. There are a couple of books out in metaphysical book stores which explain the relationship between the symbolism in the Pyramid and the steps of initiation in the Book of Dead.

 

Why Are So Many Humans Still Like Animals?

 

Q:      Weíre still like animals. How can we in this lifetime elevate ourselves to some sort of place where we feel like weíve pulled ourselves up out of the mud? You have a handful of people who know about you and believe in what you believe in or the Catholic Church or whatever it was. Look around you. All you have to do is see the decay; itís everyplace, I mean, you walk out here and you can be mugged; you can be killed for no reason whatsoever, just because youíre human. Animals donít do this to their own species. But how have we elevated ourselves in 2,000 years, 8,000 years or 10,000 years?

 

RK:      There have always been individuals who somehow or other made an oasis.

 

Q:      5, 10, 100? Millions?

 

RK:      More than that.

 

Q:      Youíve got to admit the percentage is pretty darned small.

 

RK:      Well, thatís true, but there are some.

 

Q:      What about the rest of us? Weíre trying, weíre struggling and weíre not doing a good job and we fall down, we get up again andó

 

RK:      Getting up again is what makes us human.

 

Q:      Thatís true, but where does that put us in this scheme of things? How can we even get to a decent human being?

 

RK:      Youíre a decent human being, arenít you?

 

Q:      Well, I think I am, but there are many things that Iíve done in my life that I wish I had some of this information a long, long time ago. Like your children. But it feels so hopeless when there are so many animal-type people out there.

 

RK:      And theyíre growing more and more in numbers, too, unfortunately.

 

Q:      Yes, theyíre growing more than the other kind, They can sin, and sin, and sin, and go to confession and say, ďGrant me absolution.Ē Okay, you can go out and murder tomorrow. How is that fair? That doesnít seem right.

 

RK:      Well, that all gets evened out karmically.

 

Q:      How come they can have a church that draws 8 million people and weíve got ten people here? How come so many people are sucked into that and theyíre not sucked into this?

 

RK:      Because itís easier. In those cases, you arenít required to do much. Just like in The Hidden Christ. Well , look what happened between the Gnostics, who lasted maybe a century, and the Catholic Church. The Gnostics didnít grow very fast, mainly because they demanded so much of the person who proved himself to be worthy of the information that was provided by Christ, whereas the other side said, ďWell, all you have to do is say you believe, and youíre saved.Ē Which one would you join?

 

Have Black Mentalists Ever Tried to Destroy Your [Richard] Work?

 

Q:      Do you think that Black Mentalists have come in to destroy?

 

RK:      It doesnít have to be Black Mentalists. Greed is all thatís required in many cases to undo things that weíre doing. Look at these successful corporations which are raided byópeople take over the place and then bleed all of the assets out of it and then just kind of spit out the shells, as it were. Here was a company that provided work for a lot of people, provided materials that people wanted in the world, and now the corporationís gone. Somebody, at a discounted price, as it were, managed to raid the place and take out all of the good stuff for themselves. They got wealthy. The stockholders lost out because the corporation just folded. So thatís the answer to a lot of things. Itís greed, desire for power, jealousy, seeing something good being built.

 

Why Do the Brotherhoods Allow Crime to Continue?

 

Q:      Why would the Brotherhoods allow these kinds of people to get involved?

 

RK:      They have to.

 

Q:      They have to?

RK:      They have to allow them.

 

Q:      They have free will.

 

RK:      Right. Because thereís always an opportunity to go up rather than go down.

 

Where in the Bible Does It State That We Reincarnate?

 

Q:      Where in the Bible does it state that we reincarnate?

 

RK:      Thereís no direct statement, bald faced, that comes right out and says weíve lived before or something. According to the Bible, Christ made a very straight statement that John the Baptist had existed before as Elijah.

 

Q:      He can do that, God? It doesnít mean to say that everyone can reincarnate.

 

RK:      Thatís a good argument against that particular point. But then there is also the one statement where the Apostles asked Christ, saidó they were looking at a mind who was blind, and they asked the Master, ďWho sinned that this man was born blind? His parents or did he sin?Ē Now, how can somebody sin before they were born unless they had lived at another time to sin? Fetuses do not sin, to my knowledge.

 

Q:      Could it be the offspring, like a great uncle.

 

RK:      Thatís why they asked the question. It was logical for them. It was that this child was born blind as a punishment for something his parents had done. Was it punishment for the parents, because obviously they couldnít depend upon that child to provide them with a living in their old age. It was going to be an extra hardship to deal with him, teach him anything. So that could be punishment. So that was part of their question, which one was it. In this particular case, He says, This person was not born because of any sin of himself or his parents; he was born in order to experience My healing upon him. Sort of an indication. This Ego must have made a decision before he was born to do that.

 

How Did Christ Make Himself Invisible?

 

Q:      Judas was the marketer, and there were so many times that Christ disappeared in the crowd. I believe the reason he disappeared into the crowd was that he went invisible because how could he get away from the crowd? But they could saw; they could see He was invisible.

 

RK:      Who could see Him when He was invisible?

 

Q:      The disciples.

RK:      Making oneself invisible is something that most good hypnotists can do. They can select who it is that is not going to be able to see them.

 

Q:      But thousands of people.

 

RK:      Thatís called mass hypnotism. It can be done. There are people who can do it today.

 

What Was Judasí Motivation for Betraying Christ?

 

Q:      What really confuses me about all that is that in prophecy, for thousands of years, hundreds of years, even for John the Baptist to baptize Christ, that there had to be a Judas. That wasnít really fair on Judas. I donít think so.

 

RK:      Judas wouldnít have done it if he didnít have a mind to do so in the first place. According to my teachers, Christ also set up this whole process, even unto stating what was going to happen in the future in the Pyramid of Gizeh, predicting his ownóthe time of birth of Jesus and then the work that He would do for three years that he was among mankind.

 

Q:      But what Iím saying is, Judas is looking at all this and said, ďThereís no way Heís going to be nailed on the cross.Ē I just feel it wasnít fair on Judas.

 

RK:      Judas had to do it; he wasnít manipulated into doing it. He had to agree to do it. But Judas expressed -- thereís little bits where you can just hear what Judas says. He was the one who kept the group purse, but he would also complain about, Donít give gifts away. If Martha wants to anoint you with these expensive oils, thatís really not fair, we could sell it.

 

Q:      Was he the only one who was picked by the disciples? The group, the twelve?

 

RK:      No, Christ was the one who selected His close Apostles. There were many disciples, but the twelve Apostles He selected from among those He saw around Him. But Judas had an important part to play and became a tremendously bad example, if nothing else. Maybe thatís some saving grace in some way. But one of the things that the Church says was Judasí big fault was the fact that he would not accept the idea that he could be forgiven for his weakness. But there as another reason, too, why Judas got involved. He belonged to a group called the Assassins, which was a subgroup of the Zealots, and he was very disappointed that Christ did not become the Messiah that he wanted Him to be, or envisioned Him to be. Indeed, there were hundreds of thousands of Jews at that time who were waiting for somebody like King David to come back and lead them to freedom from the Roman occupation. Judas was definitely one of those who was looking to Christ to be that kind of a leader, and when Christ over and over again was being kindly, saving people from sickness and from death, what have you, that was all pretty miraculous but it wasnít seeming to get anywhere to overthrowing the Romans, and for that reason Judas was very much disappointed and said, you know, this is a great healer, but this is not the Messiah. And because of that kind of thinking, it allowed him to turn Jesus over to the authorities.

 

Why Was Christ Feared By the Authorities?

 

Q:      There were those in political power who felt very threatened by His position and they were afraid that if He was going to start a revolution, it would either end up with the Romans killing all the Jews out of reaction or that He was just trying to throw out the present rulers, the Jewish rulers. In any event, they saw Him as a dangerous seditionary. Sometimes He goes around and gathers huge crowds and sometimes He has people going around giving secret instructions on when the revolution was going to start. They had great fears along those lines.

 


What Is Your [Richardís] View of Jesus?

 

Q:      Whatís your interpretation of Christ? I havenít read the books my wife has. Whatís your opinion on that?

 

RK:      I cannot know as an absolute by myself; I have to go by what my Teachers tell me, and over the decades I have come to find that what They tell me is pretty reliable. Their position of it is that He was an Archangel and His job was to borrow Jesusí body, as a human being, and during a three and one-half year period bring forth the information and a demonstration of how human beings should be to the people in Jerusalem, which is what He did. Another kind of miracle that is associated with that is that there are hundreds of millions of people in the world today who are Christians as a result of His walking around for three years and talking all the time. It seems to me there has to be something behind the scenes to assist that sort of thing.

 

Q:      So, you are saying He was born as a human being like you and Ió

 

RK:      That was a human Ego which gave up the use of His body to an Archangel.

 

Did Jesus Know What His Mission Would Be?

 

Q:      Do you think He knew that He was the Son of God when He was Jesus?

 

RK:      Jesus knew what his task was going to be.

 

Q:      From day one.

 

RK:      Well, maybe from the time He was a teenager. I think it is a pretty heavy load to put on anybody who is young, but even if as a Master They would have a remembrance of why they were there.

 

Q:      Because He was perfect?

 

RK:      He was a human being who had risen to the point of being a Master, which means knowing all there is to know of the first four planes of existence. That is almost like a God, so far as you and I are concerned. To rub up against such an individual, obviously, there is something special about Him. You would not necessarily know what He was. There was a kindness and a strength that was very attractive to everybody who accounted Him, men, women and children. People wanted to be around Him. He was comfortable to be around. But at the same time as Christ then took over and operated through Him, Christ told it like it is. What it is that human beings had to do, how they had to improve themselves, if they wanted to see Jerusalem be a holy nation, these are these thing that you need to do.

 

What Is a Saint?

 

Q:      So you are saying Christ is the Holy Spirit, like the Holy Spirit ?

 

RK:      We have to get back to basics here. When a person becomes a saint, they are entitled to belong to a group called the Brotherhood, which is the Brotherhood of Saints, This group of individuals who have risen to the point where they are naturally clairvoyant, they just do more good than they do harm in the world, and they have a balanced personality, they are entitled to be a saint, and saints are pretty much the same if they come up from Africa, Asia or the New World, what it takes in order to be a saint and work for the uplift of other human beings, those basic requirements are pretty much the same. So every religion in the world, not even having anything to do with Christianity, Judaism, what have you, recognize certain types of individuals as being saints. Thereís not a lot of them around, but they have been recognized.

 

Q:      Like Mother Teresa, that type thing?

 

RK:      Yeah, a person like that. I donít know that Mother Teresa is a saint.

 

Q:      They call her a saint.

 

RK:      Well, sheís Catholic, and she canít become a saint until sheís been dead for about 50 years, then they have to have all kinds of tests to see if she will qualify. She may be a saint. As a matter of fact, most people who are saints are not recognized as such by any church.

 

Q:      Itís just that thereís Mother Teresas in all organizations.

 

RK:      Right, and sometimes without organizations. They wander around and do good wherever they go. People always seem to be attracted to them for just that reason. When these groups of individuals who organize themselves in what they call the Brotherhoodsóit has nothing to do with what country they live in, or what language they speak or what race they areóthey all work together. Christianity recognizes a Communion of Saints. A communication existed between all of them because they are telepathic as well as being clairvoyant. Now, those people are the ones who are involved in helping Christ uplift mankind, All of those individuals who, letís say, became acquainted with what the overall plan was, and there are probably as many or more saints living today as there were back in those days, with all the Indian an Chinese civilizations going on in those days, that group of people knew that there was an overall plan for Christ to uplift mankind, and this Archangel was actually going to be here and act as a kind of a spur or an inspiration to a lot of people to change their way of living. to emulate Him in many ways. That didnít mean they had to heal everybody, but then again, there were many people whoó

 

Q:      But they had to live a virtuous life, right?

 

RK:      Right, and what is virtuous is not necessarily what various churches say is virtue, Virtue is being human and assisting children and people who need inspiration and people who need health restored to them, and even being kind to dogs and cats. These groups of Brotherhoods of Saints are the ones, really, who are holding the world together, as it were. You were talking, maybe thereís only a handful. Thereís only 10,000 Brothers in the United StatesóNorth America, the United States and Canada. 10,000. That means that proportionately thereís only 100 in the Dallas Metroplex.

 

Q:      That seems like quit a bit, from what I can see. Those are the higher-ups. Whatís under them? Just the average kind of guys?

 

RK:      Right. But you can become a saint.

 


Can Anyone Become a Saint?

 

Q:      In my lifetime?

 

RK:      You have a lot of time left. A lot of people say, Well, gee, I made a lot of mistakes. Thatís how we learn, is by making dumb mistakes. Itís part of the learning process, and that really drives home a point, you know, when you do something which brings karmic repercussions. Thatís our method of learning. Itís through experience that we learn, What we read about is just information, What we experience is knowledge, and knowledge is what we carry over with us Egoically forever. Nobody can convince us of another way once we know what really works.

 

Q:      If Iíve lived before, all of these other lives, and I ainít made it yet, how can I do it this time?

 

RK:      But you donít know.

 

Q:      Iím sure if I was born this time and I was a saint, Iíd know it, wouldnít I? I would know it if I was an Adept, I would know it if I was a Master?

 

RK:      Do you know anything about any of the histories of some of the Catholic saints?

 

Was Saint Francis of Assisi A Real Saint?

 

Q:      No, sir. I donít believe in the Catholic religion.

 

RK:      Well, that doesnít mean that you canít read about them. Thereís a St. Francis of Assisi who is probably one of the more revered saints among the Catholics, and he started out in his young twenties as a wastrel. Because he was born into Italian nobility, he put on armor and went to battle and slew the enemy, whoeveróif somebody said that was the enemy, he went out and killed as many as he could before he got himself killed. He ended up being practically the patron saint of animals and birds.

 

Q:      How could he be a saint if he murdered? Was he just a saint in the eyes of the people? Or was he really a saint?

 

RK:      Well, he changed. One day he had a vision and it just totally changed his life. He threw away his armor and he threw away his rank in the nobility, He was considered a coward by his fellow soldiers. He had to endure all kinds of negative publicity, as it were, but he decided that he would devote his life to the preservation of life in any form, and he totally changed his life. And ultimately he passed all the tests in order to qualify. He had the devilís court, where an advocate of the devil tried to say all the things they could to say this guy couldnít be a saint because of this and that and what have you, and then those who were advocates for the individual who was trying to be canonized. This usually takes months. Getting to be recognized as a saint in the Catholic religion is not very easy. As a matter of fact, all the old martyrs who used to be considered saints were thrown out of sainthood, I guess about twenty, twenty-five years ago, and they made a clear distinction between people who were martyrs and those who actually did things toÖ

 

(End of side of tape)

 

If they died in pain mimicking their Savior on the cross, then they would immediately be transported to the highest heaven. So they were happy to go that way. Most of them figured they were sinners and they didnít know of any other way to get there, so they were happy to be thrown to the lions.

 

What Is Your [Richardís] Job?

 

Q:      Do they have groups in the United States of people?

 

RK:      They may. Getting back to your story, I was involved with the very specific job of trying to set up a new city-state, which after the turn of the century would be the core of what would eventually become the Nation of God. Thatís my specific job. Thatís why Iíve been, I guess, in training, whether I knew it or not, or trying to set up cities, design and build them and people that would function in the ways that, say, would be in accord with the ideals expressed in The Ultimate Frontier. And there are people who are still doing that in Stelle. They just donít like the idea of having anybody tell them what to do.

 

Q:      Do we still have a timetable on that?

 

RK:      On Stelle?

 

Q:      On your job.

 

RK:      Well, in 1988 is when I was supposed to actually acquire the usage of the Island. Thatís been thrown back a couple of years because I was deprived of the money that was to be used for that was used for other reasons and purposes, so Iím still going ahead with what I can do right now and have started negotiations and am working with a couple of international lawyer, and my next step is needing to hire some people that would be kind of like my representatives to the legislature of the country that owns that island.

 

Q:      Itís not in this country then.

 

RK:      Right, itís not in America, which makes it much more difficult.

 

What Is the Deadline for Philadelphia?

 

Q:      Do we know if thereís a deadline? Is there a deadline of the year 2000?

 

RK:      Yes, thereís definitely a deadline of 2000.

 

Has the Philadelphia Island Timetable Been Setback?

 

Q:      So youíre working to that. Why have the Brotherhoods set you back two years?

 

RK:      I donít think they set me back. The Adelphi Organization managed to wrest itself free of the people who were trying to take over so Iím a member of The Adelphi Organization and the president is sitting right behind you.

 

Q:      So you donít believe that this was a setback?

 

RK:      It was definitely a setback. Iíve felt definitely set back.

 

Couldnít the Brotherhoods Just Build Philadelphia?

 

Q:      Thereís nothing the Brotherhoods could do to help you get out of it?

 

RK:      Well, you see, the Brotherhoods are not going to do this. They already know how to do all of this stuff and they donít have to do it. But thereís a whole group of people who have to come together in order to make it happen, and they have to see the advantages to themselves in order to feel inspired to put forth the effort. Now, weíre gong to need all kinds of technology. Not expensive technology, but lots of different kinds of thing which we know about and have been gathering. The Island is pure and simple a rock and sand, and most of the sand is loaded with salt. So it is not a place which is, as you might say, a Garden of Eden, because nothing grows there.

 

How Will We Grow Food on the Island of Philadelphia?

 

Q:      How will we survive?

 

RK:      Well, we can all find ways of growing our own things that we want to eat. Everybody will have a greenhouse , and some people will do so commercially. And then we will also have hydroponics.

 

Q How will we grow in sand, if thereís no earth?

 

RK:      Hydroponics. We wonít grow anything in the earth. Do you know what hydroponics is?

 

Q:      No, sir.

 

RK:      Itís a means of growing plant without soil, and you have all the nutrients that the plant needs in the form of various salts in solution, and the solution is either sprayed on the roots or is planted in some very neutral item.

 

Q:      In a liquid?

 

RK:      Yes.

How Will You Get Drinking Water for the Island?

 

Q:      That doesnít go against Godís Plan, then. I mean, he gave us this earth to grow things to nourish our bodies.

 

RK:      No. And we have a whole ocean to get water out of and we are able to desalinate it through different means, some of which require no energy whatsoever other than the sun. So there are ways in which you can live. Youíve been to Israel. Youíve seen what hey can do out of the desert by using drip irrigation, And they made areas where they decided to install these techniques. They made a garden out of what was just plain sand and tumbleweeds. We can do that, too.

 

Q:      If there is a holocaust and everything is polluted, the oceans are pollutedótheyíre polluted now.

 

RK:      You distill the water.

 

Q:      And how many people are you going to do this for?

 

RK:      There will have to be at least a quarter million.

 

Why Spend Money on Adelphi When Philadelphia Is the Goal?

 

Q:      You wonít just let anybody in though, will you?

 

RK:      Oh, no. But see, the first stage of this project is being put together here in Texas right now. Weíve got roads in for thirty acres, we have our own well, our own sewage treatment plant.

 

Q:      Why are you spending money on this one when we really need to take the money and get this island?

 

RK:      But there are people who need to be trained, and to move out on the Island, I presume a person has to have enough money to have their own house built. Because we canít built it for them. And the people who have the skills and a marketable item to build, factories, they have to be involved also.

 

Q:      And you donít have that many types of people here, right?

 

RK:      Right nowó

 

Q:      Are we going to need medical personnel?

 

RK:      Right. All those kinds of people.

 

Q:      Isnít it in one of the books I read somewhere that a lot of the medical personnel in the world are of a low vibration or something?

 

RK:      You didnít read that from me. Weíve had a number of doctors living in Stelle, who were involved in The Stelle Group. We thought they were pretty neat folks.

 

 

Was There a High-Tech Greenhouse in Stelle?

 

Q:      Iíve sprouted beans on paper towels.

 

RK:      Well, this is much the same way. Out at Stelle they had a system where they had a very large greenhouse up there, and they had a person who was growing lettuce and the lettuce just hung in the air, and it was total, without any kind of soil. It wasnít in sand, or vermiculite or anything like that. But the roots were kept in the dark and they were sprayed on a regular basis, several times a day, with the solution. And then it dripped back down into the pan and the solution would be carried off and pumped back again at another time. Itís great lettuce. I was allowed to pluck a few out of there just to see how they were. They tasted just exactly the same, just as nutritious, and yet there was no soil, no insects, It just goes to show that you can grow anything, provided it has the nutrients. It doesnít have to be in the soil.

 

What Is Happening at Stelle?

 

Q:      Can you tell me a little bit about Stelle? We were going to stop there on our way here, and we had to go a different direction. But is that a complete community and self-sufficient?

 

RK:      Not self-sufficient. 125 people, approximately.

 

Q:      So can I make this correlation, that youíve been doing this since in the Ď60ís and you have yet to build one community thatís self-sufficient?

 

RK:      Uh-huh.

 

Q:      How can you possibly take an island that you havenít purchased yet and have it ready for people in nine years?

 

RK:      With the modern miracle of money. Thatís the only way it can happen.

 

What Kind of Person Would Be Interested in Philadelphia?

 

Q:      Then youíre talking to the wrong group of people. Youíve got to be talking to millionaires. Because theyíre the peopleóyou can go round, hand to mouth, and tell your relatives and so on, but it wonít do it; it wonít cut it. Youíve got to get some people who have the big bucks.

 

RK:      I agree. I think that if a person has $50,000 that they can come up with, mostly by selling their home or their property that they have, they would be able to build for considerably less than what their house would cost in this country and have a very pleasant home and be able to partake of the things that everybody else is doing to built. Let me say that the person that we need to appeal to are the person who say, I need a challenge. I grow up in the city and everything is here already. My job is one where I hope to put together enough money so I can retire and send my kids to college, the American dream, nice car. And for many people, that is not enough. They need a frontier to challenge them and they want one. Thereís no places for them, no places where they can be free to try the different things that they want to do. There are people who have great ideas and they could be put into commercial use except that there are manyóyou say, ďWell, youíre going to go into competition that weíve set up.Ē Weíve got hundreds of millions, or maybe billions, invested in. Thatís going to put a lot of people out of work if you come up with this great new idea, so those great ideas are suppressed.

 

Q:      Who is going to control this? Is there going to be like a president or your own country ruled by who?

 

RK:      Well, it will be a city-state. Thatís the best way to think of it. I have to work within the constraints of another country so they wonít put much effort into trying toó

 

Q:      But who will rule it?

 

RK:      The people who are involved will be the ones whoó